{"id":61265,"date":"2024-02-28T09:00:22","date_gmt":"2024-02-28T08:00:22","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/dzogchentoday.org\/?p=61265"},"modified":"2024-03-12T10:11:20","modified_gmt":"2024-03-12T09:11:20","slug":"autour-dun-bol-de-soupe","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/dzogchentoday.org\/fr\/autour-dun-bol-de-soupe\/","title":{"rendered":"Autour d\u2019un bol de soupe"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>[et_pb_section fb_built=&#8221;1&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; background_image=&#8221;https:\/\/dzogchentoday.org\/wp-dzogtodaychen-content\/uploads\/2024\/02\/One-Bowl-of-Soup.jpg&#8221; background_size=&#8221;initial&#8221; background_repeat=&#8221;repeat-x&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||226px|||&#8221; collapsed=&#8221;off&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_row column_structure=&#8221;3_5,2_5&#8243; admin_label=&#8221;Ligne&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;3_5&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.19.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; header_font=&#8221;Montserrat|700|||||||&#8221; header_text_align=&#8221;center&#8221; text_text_shadow_style=&#8221;preset1&#8243; text_text_shadow_color=&#8221;rgba(0,0,0,0.82)&#8221; header_text_shadow_style=&#8221;preset1&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<h1 style=\"text-align: center\"><span style=\"color: #f4f4f4\">Autour d\u2019un bol de soupe<\/span><\/h1>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][\/et_pb_column][et_pb_column type=&#8221;2_5&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.19.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_divider show_divider=&#8221;off&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; 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custom_margin=&#8221;||-2px|||&#8221; header_font_size_tablet=&#8221;&#8221; header_font_size_phone=&#8221;18px&#8221; header_font_size_last_edited=&#8221;on|phone&#8221; icon_font_size=&#8221;33px&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; icon_color__hover_enabled=&#8221;on|desktop&#8221; icon_color__hover=&#8221;#13204d&#8221;]@ET-DC@eyJkeW5hbWljIjp0cnVlLCJjb250ZW50IjoicG9zdF9hdXRob3JfYmlvIiwic2V0dGluZ3MiOnsiYmVmb3JlIjoiIiwiYWZ0ZXIiOiIiLCJlbmFibGVfaHRtbCI6Im9mZiJ9fQ==@[\/et_pb_blurb][\/et_pb_column][et_pb_column type=&#8221;1_2&#8243; module_class=&#8221;column2&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.16&#8243; custom_padding=&#8221;|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; custom_padding__hover=&#8221;|||&#8221;][et_pb_blurb title=&#8221;@ET-DC@eyJkeW5hbWljIjp0cnVlLCJjb250ZW50IjoicG9zdF9jYXRlZ29yaWVzIiwic2V0dGluZ3MiOnsiYmVmb3JlIjoiIiwiYWZ0ZXIiOiIiLCJsaW5rX3RvX3Rlcm1fcGFnZSI6Im9uIiwic2VwYXJhdG9yIjoiIHwgIiwiY2F0ZWdvcnlfdHlwZSI6ImNhdGVnb3J5IiwiZW5hYmxlX2h0bWwiOiJvZmYifX0=@&#8221; use_icon=&#8221;on&#8221; font_icon=&#8221;&#xe08c;||divi||400&#8243; icon_color=&#8221;#e2e2e2&#8243; icon_placement=&#8221;left&#8221; image_icon_width=&#8221;33px&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _dynamic_attributes=&#8221;title&#8221; header_font=&#8221;|700|||||||&#8221; header_font_size=&#8221;20px&#8221; body_text_color=&#8221;#967b5d&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;||0px|&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||26px|||&#8221; header_font_size_tablet=&#8221;&#8221; header_font_size_phone=&#8221;18px&#8221; header_font_size_last_edited=&#8221;on|phone&#8221; icon_font_size=&#8221;33px&#8221; locked=&#8221;off&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; icon_color__hover=&#8221;#13204d&#8221; icon_color__hover_enabled=&#8221;on&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p>Cet article illustre l\u2019espace de la coloc\u2019 avec Gr\u00e9goire et Paul pour d\u00e9sapprendre ses habitudes&#8230; autour d&#8217;un bol de soupe !<\/p>\n<p>.<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_blurb][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][\/et_pb_section][et_pb_section fb_built=&#8221;1&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; hover_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; sticky_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243;][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; hover_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; sticky_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; hover_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;2em&#8221; sticky_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243;]<\/p>\n<h2>Autour d\u2019un bol de soupe<\/h2>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; custom_margin=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; hover_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; sticky_enabled=&#8221;0&#8243;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.16&#8243; custom_padding=&#8221;|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221; custom_padding__hover=&#8221;|||&#8221;][et_pb_text quote_border_weight=&#8221;0px&#8221; quote_border_color=&#8221;rgba(0,0,0,0)&#8221; module_id=&#8221;bas-1&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; text_font=&#8221;Montserrat||||||||&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; link_font=&#8221;|600||||||#000000|&#8221; link_text_color=&#8221;#BF9E77&#8243; link_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; link_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; quote_font=&#8221;Cormorant Garamond|700|||||||&#8221; quote_text_color=&#8221;#bf9e77&#8243; quote_line_height=&#8221;1.3em&#8221; header_font=&#8221;|700|||||||&#8221; header_2_font=&#8221;|700|||||||&#8221; header_3_font=&#8221;Montserrat|700|||||||&#8221; header_3_text_color=&#8221;#000000&#8243; header_4_letter_spacing=&#8221;12px&#8221; header_5_font=&#8221;|300|||||||&#8221; header_5_text_color=&#8221;#bfbfbf&#8221; header_5_letter_spacing=&#8221;12px&#8221; header_6_font=&#8221;Montserrat|700|||||||&#8221; header_6_letter_spacing=&#8221;6px&#8221; module_alignment=&#8221;center&#8221; quote_font_size_tablet=&#8221;&#8221; quote_font_size_phone=&#8221;&#8221; quote_font_size_last_edited=&#8221;on|desktop&#8221; locked=&#8221;off&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8221; Ce qui est g\u00e9nial, en colocation, c\u2019est que tu n\u2019es pas souverain. Tu ne r\u00e8gnes pas sur ton territoire, tu dois le partager, rentrer dans des cohabitations, des dialogues, des \u00ab syncr\u00e9tisations \u00bb. Tu partages l\u2019espace et tu dois <em>d\u00e9sapprendre<\/em> cette injonction presque animale \u00ab ici c\u2019est chez moi et pas chez toi \u00bb. Du coup, on s\u2019est dit qu\u2019on allait partager aussi l\u2019espace de l\u2019article, cette page o\u00f9 l\u2019auteur se croit trop souvent \u00ab ma\u00eetre en son vaisseau \u00bb. Qu\u2019est-ce que tu en penses ? Tu veux manger avec moi, ce soir ? J\u2019ai fait une soupe. &#8220;<\/p>\n<p>GR\u00c9GOIRE : &#8220;Excellente id\u00e9e ! Mais pour la soupe, je pr\u00e9f\u00e8re qu\u2019on remette \u00e7a \u00e0 une autre fois. L\u00e0, je dois me concentrer sur mon travail et pr\u00e9f\u00e8re manger tout seul. M\u00eame en colocation, on n\u2019est pas sociable tous les jours&#8230;&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8220;Ok, je t\u2019en mets un peu de c\u00f4t\u00e9 au frigo.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;10px&#8221; header_2_font=&#8221;|||on|||||&#8221; header_2_text_align=&#8221;center&#8221; header_2_font_size=&#8221;33px&#8221; header_2_letter_spacing=&#8221;3px&#8221; header_2_line_height=&#8221;1.6em&#8221; header_3_font_size=&#8221;25px&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;0px|||||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<h2><span style=\"font-size: x-large\"><em><span style=\"color: #bf9e77\">&#8221; Ah, \u00e7a sent le v\u00e9cu \u00e7a ! Un autre aspect de la vie colocative qui me semble tr\u00e8s enrichissant, m\u00eame si c\u2019est difficile, c\u2019est qu\u2019avec le temps on se voit mieux soi-m\u00eame. On n\u2019a pas le choix.&#8221;<\/span><\/em><\/span><\/h2>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; text_font=&#8221;Montserrat||||||||&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;0px|||||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p>\u00a0GR\u00c9GOIRE : &#8220;Merci. C\u2019est tr\u00e8s gentil. Discutons un peu quand m\u00eame par contre !<br \/>C\u2019est certain que l\u2019aspect presque animal du territoire : \u201cc\u2019est chez moi\u201d, \u201cc\u2019est \u00e0 moi\u201d, est largement questionn\u00e9 lorsque l\u2019on cohabite avec d\u2019autres personnes, que l\u2019on vit en collectif ou en communaut\u00e9. Mon bol pr\u00e9f\u00e9r\u00e9 offert par ma grand-m\u00e8re finit par devenir la gamelle du chat. Le manche du beau et pr\u00e9cieux couteau que mon fr\u00e8re m\u2019a offert pour No\u00ebl se brise \u00e0 cause d\u2019un usage, disons\u2026 vraiment pas adapt\u00e9. Je vous passe les d\u00e9tails rocambolesques ! Et pour finir, on le jette m\u00eame sans aucun remords \u00e0 la poubelle\u2026 Alors la vie colocative, c\u2019est clair que \u00e7a fait travailler sur soi. Par exemple, sur l\u2019attachement que l\u2019on a tr\u00e8s souvent \u00e0 \u201cnos\u201d affaires, \u00e0 \u201cnotre\u201d territoire ; \u00e0 \u201cmon-chez-moi-\u00e0-moi\u201d.<\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; min_height=&#8221;1542.1px&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.23&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; text_font=&#8221;Montserrat||||||||&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; width=&#8221;100%&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8220;Dans toutes les colocs que j\u2019ai travers\u00e9es ces quinze derni\u00e8res ann\u00e9es, j\u2019ai en effet toujours observ\u00e9 ma facult\u00e9, malgr\u00e9 le changement d\u2019environnement, \u00e0 y apporter mon propre espace, \u00e0 la fois int\u00e9rieur (mes \u00e9motions, mes habitudes, mes projections), et ext\u00e9rieur (mes objets, mes meubles, ma mani\u00e8re de ranger). Moi qui croyais changer d\u2019espace ! \u00c0 chaque fois je recr\u00e9ais le m\u00eame, juste assez diff\u00e9rent pour pouvoir recommencer de r\u00e9p\u00e9ter, d\u2019obtemp\u00e9rer aux m\u00eames sch\u00e9mas, injonctions, \u00e9motions et habitudes de vie que j\u2019avais d\u2019abord observ\u00e9s dans la premi\u00e8re de toutes mes colocs : chez mes parents !&#8221;<\/p>\n<p><em>(rires<\/em>)\u00a0<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][et_pb_image src=&#8221;https:\/\/dzogchentoday.org\/wp-dzogtodaychen-content\/uploads\/2024\/02\/One-Bowl-of-Soup-1.jpg&#8221; alt=&#8221;Dzogchentoday- One bowl of soup @marevabernard&#8221; title_text=&#8221;One Bowl of Soup&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; min_height=&#8221;457.7px&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][\/et_pb_image][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.23&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; text_font=&#8221;Montserrat||||||||&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; width=&#8221;100%&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p>GR\u00c9GOIRE : &#8220;Et sur l\u2019occupation de l\u2019espace lui-m\u00eame \u2014 physique, mais pas que\u2026 \u2014 on doit souvent faire des concessions, des ajustements, en laisser \u00e0 autrui. Pour \u00e7a, on doit faire l\u2019effort \u2014 impossible en tant que tel \u2014 de se mettre \u00e0 la place de l\u2019autre, d\u2019essayer de comprendre sa perspective, ses besoins et ses souhaits. Comme on a chacun nos habitudes de vie, parfois tr\u00e8s diff\u00e9rentes les unes des autres \u2014 la nourriture, les horaires, la musique, le degr\u00e9 de rangement ou de propret\u00e9 absolument in-objectivable, etc. etc. \u2014 on doit apprendre, de gr\u00e9 ou de force, \u00e0 ne pas (trop) juger comment les autres vivent et se comportent. Quel entra\u00eenement au non-jugement, \u00e0 l\u2019\u00e9quanimit\u00e9 ! Suspension du jugement !&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>(<em>rires<\/em>)\u00a0<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8220;C\u2019est clair ! Et l\u2019on voit en g\u00e9n\u00e9ral qu\u2019on est bien peu entra\u00een\u00e9 \u00e0 cela, et qu\u2019il faut m\u00eame commencer tr\u00e8s graduellement par envisager que le \u201cnon-jugement\u201d est possible, dans notre exp\u00e9rience de la vie colocative, jour apr\u00e8s jour, de la vaisselle mal-lav\u00e9e au gars qui organise des f\u00eates spontan\u00e9es \u00e0 2h du matin pr\u00e9cis\u00e9ment le jour o\u00f9 tu as un examen.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>GR\u00c9GOIRE : &#8220;Ah, \u00e7a sent le v\u00e9cu \u00e7a ! Un autre aspect de la vie colocative qui me semble tr\u00e8s enrichissant, m\u00eame si c\u2019est difficile, c\u2019est qu\u2019avec le temps on se voit mieux soi-m\u00eame. On n\u2019a pas le choix. La vie colocative, comme tout projet collectif, c\u2019est comme un miroir. \u00c7a te fait voir tes propres tendances, tes habitudes. C\u2019est un vrai r\u00e9v\u00e9lateur, un miroir grossissant. Ayant grandi dans le confort priv\u00e9 de ma petite chambre d\u2019enfant \u2014 mon jardin secret \u2014, j\u2019en suis finalement venu en vivant en collectif, \u00e0 n\u2019avoir quasiment plus de vie \u201cpriv\u00e9e\u201d. Tout se voit, tout s\u2019entend \u2014 ou presque. Avec le temps, chacune de tes habitudes (internes) se r\u00e9v\u00e8le au grand jour (externe), comme si tu \u00e9tais mis \u00e0 nu. Rien n\u2019est laiss\u00e9 dans l\u2019ombre. L\u2019avantage donc, c\u2019est qu\u2019en tant qu\u2019apprenti pratiquant du Dzogch\u00e8n, \u00e7a te fait acc\u00e9l\u00e9rer sur le chemin : un bon gros travail de fond sur nos tendances ! Et une pacification certaine des \u00e9motions, si tu veux survivre dans la dur\u00e9e \u00e0 cette forme de vie collective\u2026 Tu n\u2019as pas aussi cette impression ?&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8220;Oui, les colocs forment des communaut\u00e9s humaines intenses et donc tr\u00e8s int\u00e9ressantes pour les pratiquants Dzogch\u00e8n. N\u2019\u00e9tait-ce pas cela, dans le cadre traditionnel, le r\u00f4le des monast\u00e8res, des camps et des ermitages de yogis ? On a parfois l\u2019impression que ce sont des couveuses o\u00f9 on peut rester au chaud loin des probl\u00e8mes, mais en fait, tout centre de pratique spirituelle est un creuset o\u00f9 bouillonnent et explosent toutes les \u00e9motions conflictuelles de l\u2019humanit\u00e9, un lieu-miroir qui te renvoie toutes tes projections sur toi-m\u00eame et autrui. Donc, si on rentre dans ce type de lieu pour \u00e9viter de regarder ses propres probl\u00e8mes, \u00e7a risque de ne pas marcher ; mais si, au contraire, on a engag\u00e9 une vraie dynamique d\u2019introspection, chaque \u00e9v\u00e9nement de la vie communautaire devient riche de sens et d\u2019enseignements. L\u2019espace priv\u00e9 \u00e9tant devenu plus relatif, l\u2019espace partag\u00e9 devient le lieu d\u2019exp\u00e9rimentations sur la relativit\u00e9 du \u201cmoi\u201d et ses possessions illusoires.&#8221;\u00a0<\/p>\n<p>GREGOIRE : &#8220;C\u2019est vraiment tr\u00e8s int\u00e9ressant ta comparaison avec les monast\u00e8res, pr\u00e9cis\u00e9ment \u00e0 l\u2019heure o\u00f9 ils finissent de s\u2019\u00e9teindre, ou presque, en Europe occidentale ; et o\u00f9 la civilisation du cocon Netflix-pizza-pyjama semble prendre le relais. Je caricature\u2026 mais pas tant que \u00e7a ! Chacun dans sa bulle, son <em>safe<\/em> space, c\u2019est plus <em>secure<\/em>. On l\u2019a bien vu avec le Covid. Ainsi, la colocation serait une nouvelle forme de vie monacale ?!\u2026 enfin, sur certains points. Et ce n\u2019est pas pour rien que nombre de communaut\u00e9s des ann\u00e9es 1960-70 (on dit <em>septante<\/em> d\u2019ailleurs, en Belgique et en Suisse !) ont \u00e9t\u00e9 influenc\u00e9es par la vie des monast\u00e8res ou m\u00eame des premi\u00e8res communaut\u00e9s chr\u00e9tiennes. On pourrait dire beaucoup de choses l\u00e0-dessus\u2026 M\u00eame si le Dzogch\u00e8n n\u2019a pas en tant que tel besoin de monast\u00e8re ou de forme de vie particuli\u00e8re pour se pratiquer, \u00e9tant donn\u00e9 qu\u2019il s\u2019adapte \u00e0 toutes les conditions. Par contre, parfois, certaines conditions peuvent aider\u2026 Mais j\u2019ai peur d\u2019\u00eatre trop long et de ne pas te laisser assez d\u2019espace, alors \u00e0 toi la parole !&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8220;Dans toute l\u2019Europe, et en Belgique en particulier, nous avons l\u2019exemple des b\u00e9guinages, ces femmes qui d\u00e9cidaient de vivre ensemble, sans protecteur masculin \u2014 et donc en dehors du syst\u00e8me patriarcal \u2014, pour se consacrer \u00e0 la pratique spirituelle. Quelques-unes des grandes figures de la mystique belge ont \u00e9merg\u00e9 gr\u00e2ce \u00e0 ces communaut\u00e9s : Marguerite Porete, Hadewijch d&#8217;Anvers\u2026 Ces personnes qui s\u2019engageaient \u00e0 recr\u00e9er un vivre-ensemble centr\u00e9 sur une dimension primordiale, <em>sous un toit<\/em> <em>spirituel<\/em>, me semblent des exemples utiles dans notre \u00e9poque de d\u00e9sagr\u00e9gation o\u00f9 l\u2019individu m\u00eame se trouve coup\u00e9 de lui-m\u00eame.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; width=&#8221;70%&#8221; min_height=&#8221;512.5px&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;3px||4px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_image src=&#8221;https:\/\/dzogchentoday.org\/wp-dzogtodaychen-content\/uploads\/2024\/02\/One-Bowl-of-Soup-2.jpg&#8221; alt=&#8221;Dzogchentoday- One bowl of soup @marevabernard&#8221; title_text=&#8221;One bowl of soup&#8221; align=&#8221;center&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; width=&#8221;25%&#8221; max_width=&#8221;66%&#8221; module_alignment=&#8221;center&#8221; box_shadow_style=&#8221;preset2&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][\/et_pb_image][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;4px||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.21.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; text_font=&#8221;Montserrat||||||||&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; min_height=&#8221;170.4px&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p>GREGOIRE : &#8220;Tu penses aussi \u00e0 <a href=\"https:\/\/www.vuesdelesprit.org\/publication\/christine-l-admirable\/\">Christine dite l\u2019Admirable<\/a> ? Cette \u00e9trange sainte femme des environs de Li\u00e8ge qui passa pour morte et revint \u00e0 la vie pour purger les peines des vivants et les guider vers Dieu apr\u00e8s avoir visit\u00e9 enfer, purgatoire et paradis ? \u00c7a me rappelle un peu les d\u00e9log (tib. <em>\u2019das log)<\/em> tib\u00e9taines, souvent des femmes qui, dans un \u00e9tat cataleptique, font ce type de \u201cvoyage\u201d et reviennent charg\u00e9es de messages pour leur communaut\u00e9 ?* Une profonde exploration int\u00e9rieure personnelle \u2014 \u00e0 ce moment, elles ne montrent aucun signe ext\u00e9rieur de vie \u2014 qui a ensuite une influence sur toute la vie de la communaut\u00e9. Mais vivre ensemble autour de cette dimension primordiale que tu \u00e9voques est devenu bien rare de nos jours, et bien difficile \u00e0 l\u2019essai&#8230; Ce sont souvent de tout autres motifs qui nous font vivre en collectivit\u00e9 : \u00e9conomique, affectif, etc. Tu penses qu\u2019on devrait s\u2019inspirer de ces saintes femmes pour notre vie en communaut\u00e9 ?&#8221;\u00a0<\/p>\n<p>\u00a0PAUL : &#8220;Disons que m\u00eame si les figures de saintes et de saints peuvent \u00eatre inspirantes, elles ont effectivement leurs limites dans nos conditions culturelles actuelles\u2026 Ce qui m\u2019int\u00e9resse, c\u2019est que ces communaut\u00e9s mystiques ont leur actualit\u00e9 dans le cadre de la pratique Dzogch\u00e8n car elles se sont regroup\u00e9es autour d\u2019un esprit commun de pratique contemplative. Il ne s\u2019agit pas de r\u00e9investir un concept de \u201cr\u00e8gle monastique\u201d, mais bien de recentrer nos individualit\u00e9s sur notre bont\u00e9 fondamentale, tout en maintenant des pratiques d\u2019introspection \u00e9thique et de travail d\u2019\u00e9coute mutuelle, ce qu\u2019on appelle en tib\u00e9tain \u201cLojong\u201d (tib. <em>blo sbyong<\/em>), \u201centra\u00eenement de l\u2019esprit\u201d. L\u2019entra\u00eenement de l\u2019esprit, c\u2019est le travail de soi sur soi en rapport avec les autres, dans le cadre de l\u2019exp\u00e9rience primordiale.<\/p>\n<p>Tu es s\u00fbr que tu ne veux pas de soupe ?&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>GREGOIRE : &#8220;Allez, juste un petit bol alors\u2026 Et tu nous parles du Bouddhisme tib\u00e9tain \u00e0 pr\u00e9sent avec ton <em>Lojong<\/em>, non plus de Dzogch\u00e8n radical ! (<em>rires<\/em>) Mais il est certain que ces exercices tr\u00e8s concrets sont inestimables dans la vie commune avec les autres. Ils retournent toutes tes habitudes \u00e9go\u00efstes sens dessus dessous ! Parfois tr\u00e8s utiles pour la vie en colocation, m\u00eame si pas si facile \u00e0 mettre en pratique\u2026 Je blaguais parfois avec ma compagne : \u201csans ceux-ci, il y a bien longtemps que nous ne serions plus ensemble\u201d ! Ces petits \u201ctrucs\u201d de l\u2019esprit \u00e0 appliquer en toutes circonstances, ces petits bijoux de techniques-qui-se-fondent-\u00e0-la-vie, sont tr\u00e8s simples et pourtant tr\u00e8s puissants pour mieux vivre ensemble. Sans \u00e7a, bien des monast\u00e8res tib\u00e9tains n\u2019auraient pas tenus ! Je sp\u00e9cule\u2026 Mais effectivement, mettre au c\u0153ur de nos vies, cet aspect ultime, primordial, essentiel de notre existence \u2014 ou comme on voudra l\u2019appeler \u2014 ce n\u2019est souvent pas facile dans les vies en collectif. On est accapar\u00e9 par toutes sortes de pr\u00e9tendus probl\u00e8mes plus urgents ou plus importants qui tr\u00e8s souvent mettent le \u201cmoi\u201d en avant et emp\u00eachent de prendre un certain recul. Cela emp\u00eache de retrouver de l\u2019espace pour voir ce qui \u2014 au miroir de la mort \u2014 importe vraiment, et d\u2019apercevoir cette dimension source de tout, \u00e0 la base de tout, qui n\u2019est m\u00eame plus une dimension.\u2026&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>PAUL : &#8220;Ce qui est int\u00e9ressant dans les <em>Lojong<\/em>, c\u2019est la dialectique entre pr\u00e9sentation de la nature de l\u2019esprit et travail \u00e9thique concret sur nos tendances \u00e9gocentriques. Gu\u00e9sh\u00e9 Ch\u00e9kawa (XIIe s.), dans <em><a href=\"https:\/\/www.lotsawahouse.org\/fr\/tibetan-masters\/geshe-chekhawa-yeshe-dorje\/seven-points-mind-training\">L\u2019Entra\u00eenement en sept points<\/a>,<\/em> \u00e9crit aussi bien \u201cP\u00e9n\u00e8tre l\u2019aspect premier de l\u2019\u00e9vidence primordiale non-n\u00e9e\u201d que \u201cNe parle pas des d\u00e9fauts d\u2019autrui\u201d, ou \u201cNe fais pas ton bonheur du malheur d\u2019autrui\u201d.<\/p>\n<p>GREGOIRE : &#8221; Et parmi ces exercices et autres petites phrases-mn\u00e9motechniques qui m\u2019ont beaucoup aid\u00e9, il y a ceux venant des <em><a href=\"https:\/\/www.lotsawahouse.org\/fr\/tibetan-masters\/gyalse-thogme-zangpo\/37-practices-all-bodhisattvas\">37 pratiques des bodhisattavas<\/a><\/em> (ou <em>\u00eatres d\u2019\u00e9veil<\/em>) de Gyals\u00e9 Thogm\u00e9 (XIVe s.), sorte de commentaire du texte de Ch\u00e9kawa, et en particulier cette simple petite tournure : \u201c<em>m\u00eame si<\/em>\u2026\u201d Quoi qu\u2019il arrive (\u201dm\u00eame si\u2026\u201d), ce n\u2019est jamais une excuse suffisante pour ne pas agir \u00e0 partir de cette bont\u00e9 fondamentale dont tu parlais, ou pour oublier la nature de l\u2019esprit&#8230; En substance, et pour ce dont je me souviens : \u201cM\u00eame si quelqu\u2019un que tu as ch\u00e9ri comme ton propre fils, t\u2019insulte injustement en public, consid\u00e8re-le comme l\u2019\u00eatre le plus cher, fais l\u2019\u00e9loge de ses qualit\u00e9s : telle est la pratique de tous les \u00eatres d\u2019\u00e9veil.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Pour simplifier : toujours mettre l\u2019autre en premier, avant soi-m\u00eame. Une des pratiques essentielles du <em>Lojong<\/em> : prendre sur soi la d\u00e9faite, offrir \u00e0 autrui la victoire. Bien s\u00fbr, \u00e7a peut sembler extr\u00eame dans nos conditions et il faut \u00eatre patiemment guid\u00e9 dans ces pratiques&#8230; mais \u00e0 l\u2019essai, elles peuvent se r\u00e9v\u00e9ler extr\u00eamement b\u00e9n\u00e9fiques pour soi et pour tous les autres avec lesquels nous vivons\u2026<\/p>\n<p>Tu termines la soupe ?&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][et_pb_divider color=&#8221;#BF9E77&#8243; divider_weight=&#8221;2px&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; width=&#8221;42%&#8221; module_alignment=&#8221;left&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][\/et_pb_divider][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.24.2&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||||false|false&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.23&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.23&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; text_font=&#8221;Montserrat||||||||&#8221; text_font_size=&#8221;18px&#8221; text_line_height=&#8221;1.8em&#8221; min_height=&#8221;78.5px&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p><em>Note : <a href=\"https:\/\/www.clairelumiere.com\/prd\/20-voyage-au-dela-de-la-mort.html\">Delog Dewa Dr\u00f6lma, *Voyage au-del\u00e0 de la mort<\/a><span style=\"color: #bf9e77\">,<\/span><\/em><span style=\"color: #bf9e77\"> 1995<\/span><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/www.cnrseditions.fr\/catalogue\/anthropologie-et-mondes-contemporains\/les-revenants-lau-dela-dans-monde-tibetain-francoise-pommaret\/\">Fran\u00e7oise Pommaret, <em>Les Revenants de l\u2019au-del\u00e0 dans le monde tib\u00e9tain\u00a0: Sources litt\u00e9raires et tradition vivante<\/em>, Paris, CNRS \u00c9ditions, 1989<\/a>).<\/p>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][\/et_pb_section][et_pb_section fb_built=&#8221;1&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.6&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; module_alignment=&#8221;right&#8221; min_height=&#8221;13.8px&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;0px||2px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][\/et_pb_section][et_pb_section fb_built=&#8221;1&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; min_height=&#8221;103.8px&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;-137px|||||&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;0px||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_row column_structure=&#8221;1_2,1_2&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.6&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; module_alignment=&#8221;right&#8221; min_height=&#8221;89.6px&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;|auto|-50px|auto||&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;1_2&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.6&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][\/et_pb_column][et_pb_column type=&#8221;1_2&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.6&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_code _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.6&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; positioning=&#8221;fixed&#8221; position_origin_f=&#8221;center_right&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;|30px|||false|false&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][DISPLAY_ULTIMATE_PLUS][\/et_pb_code][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; min_height=&#8221;61.1px&#8221; custom_margin=&#8221;53px|auto||auto||&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;0px||0px|||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_text _builder_version=&#8221;4.18.0&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; min_height=&#8221;0px&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;65px|||||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;]<\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center\">PLUS D&#8217;ARTICLES<\/h2>\n<p>[\/et_pb_text][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][\/et_pb_section][et_pb_section fb_built=&#8221;1&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; custom_padding=&#8221;1px|||||&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][dsm_blog_carousel include_categories=&#8221;2,30,31&#8243; use_readmore=&#8221;on&#8221; _builder_version=&#8221;4.17.4&#8243; _module_preset=&#8221;default&#8221; min_height=&#8221;630px&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][\/dsm_blog_carousel][\/et_pb_column][\/et_pb_row][\/et_pb_section][et_pb_section fb_built=&#8221;1&#8243; admin_label=&#8221;Opt-In 2&#8243; module_class=&#8221;sfly_optin sfly_optin_2&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.19.1&#8243; use_background_color_gradient=&#8221;on&#8221; background_color_gradient_stops=&#8221;rgba(255,255,255,0.9) 0%|rgba(255,255,255,0.9) 100%&#8221; background_color_gradient_overlays_image=&#8221;on&#8221; background_color_gradient_start=&#8221;rgba(255,255,255,0.9)&#8221; background_color_gradient_end=&#8221;rgba(255,255,255,0.9)&#8221; background_image=&#8221;https:\/\/dzogchentoday.org\/wp-dzogtodaychen-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/dzogchentoday-main3.gif&#8221; animation_style=&#8221;fade&#8221; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_row _builder_version=&#8221;4.16&#8243; global_colors_info=&#8221;{}&#8221;][et_pb_column type=&#8221;4_4&#8243; _builder_version=&#8221;4.16&#8243; custom_padding=&#8221;|||&#8221; 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